Making more wort than your kettle can handle....

[fakr]

Last night, I made my first 20GAL batch of wort...well 19GAL....using my 20GAL kettle.  I've done this technique before but not to this size, using the same summer ale recipe, without any noticeable change of taste, smell, fermentation, etc.

I'm sharing this in case any of you have a 50L kettle and just can't seem to make a 10GAL batch...


I mash out about 17GAL in my kettle and boil as normal, leaving a good 5-6GAL of mash temp water in my mash tun.  Periodically throughout the boil, I open the ball valve and transfer from the mash tun into the kettle.  The boil will slow and almost stop as the level rises back up to 17-18GAL.  

By the end of the 1 hour boil, I transfer the remaining mash wort into the kettle, while turning the propane way up.  

In the end, I was left with roughly 19.5-20GAL of slightly simmering wort in my kettle.  A gentle whirlpool to the kettle, cover and let sit 10-15 minutes before cooling and transferring.  The slight simmer in addition to the 10-15 minute rest ensures pasturization of the addition of the mash wort at the end of the boil.

I ended up with 4 fermentors, all at the 18L mark.

I just need 1 more GAL which could be preboiled and cooled water to top up the fermentor.

Mind you, you have to plan this out as it will change the anticipated gravity from the original recipe.

[DandyMason]

Very cool.

Yeah I have heard of ppl boiling a smaller volume of strong wort and diluting with boiled water to get a larger volume at a lower gravity.

[fakr]

I'm sure some will probably have issues with this technique, as there is a reason for boiling wort for a period of time, BUT, I've not noticed any change in the quality of the beer this technique has made.

At the same time, the beers I've made with this technique have been light summer type, lower gravity beers.

[jeffsmith]

At the same time, the beers I've made with this technique have been light summer type, lower gravity beers.

Perfectly suited to this type of beer I think. If you were brewing a darker beer (stout) or a German style that you were looking for some melanoidin formation, it might not work quite as well.

[Richard]

Sounds similar to the late-addition of DME/extracts... shouldn't be a massive problem. If you get too few melanoidins you could just throw a decoction mash into the mix.

[fakr]

Richard, Jeff, can one of you explain a short detail your comments on melanoidins?  Maybe their purpose in wort, how they are formed, and perhaps the side effects of too few in wort?

Also, just throwing this out there, but what about an addition of melanoidin malt?

[Richard]

Melanoidins are the "malty" flavour in beer (bready, toasty, etc - generally not sweet). They get formed in boiling wort with amino acids and sugars getting bonded together by the heat. You could potentially compensate with maltier grains (i.e. going up the scale with MO, Vienna, Munich, and finally - like you mentioned, melanoidin malt). I don't know of any substitution formulae though, so you'd have to do it by intuition/experience.

[Richard]

I should add that the scale there is with increasing initial melanoidin content, from how the malts are kilned. You could therefore replace melanoidins produced in the boil with a maltier base, or do a decoction mash to produce melanoidins in the actual mash pre-boil.

[fakr]

Thanks Richard.

So is it safe for me to assume that if I do my initial mash at a higher temp, creating a sweeter wort, that would compensate for adding the additional amount of "dry" wort from the mash near the end of the boil to create a medium wort?

[Richard]

First off - I think it's a common misconception that higher mash temp = sweeter beer. It adds body, not sweetness. Your yeast strain (and its ability to process maltotriose) is the main determinant in how sweet a beer ends up.

Second, the higher mash temp would not produce a useful amount of extra melanoidins - all you get is more complex dextrins - and a higher body as I mentioned. You either need a decoction mash (where you're boiling a portion of the mash to make a temperature step), or you need more melanoidin-rich malt at the outset, to compensate.

All this said, I'm not sure you'd notice much less melanoidin flavour from your process there, as the bulk of the precursors would have been present in the first runnings - RDWHAHB

[fakr]

understood....well except for "RDWHAHB"!!  lol!  

Richard Done What He At Ho Bitches?

[Richard]

Someone's never read Joy of Homebrewing

[Kyle]

RDWHAHB = relax, don't worry, and have a homebrew (from Papazian's book)

[Chris Craig]

First off - I think it's a common misconception that higher mash temp = sweeter beer. It adds body, not sweetness.

John Palmer disagrees with you: http://www.howtobrew.com/section4/chapter20-1.html

All things being equal, a higher mash temp will result in a higher terminal gravity...sweeter beer.

[fakr]

like I'm going to remember that guys!